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Post by sw6201 on Feb 23, 2008 20:56:21 GMT -5
what is the anticipated kindergarten enrollment for southdale this upcoming school year, around 90, the school is set up to be a 20 section school and this would make it a 24 section school.
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lulu
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Post by lulu on Feb 24, 2008 0:35:13 GMT -5
i have continued this thought on the thread under suggestions.
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d1
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Post by d1 on Feb 25, 2008 16:18:57 GMT -5
We can all agree that moving children is not the ideal and should be avoided when possible. It CAN be avoided now. They can use open enrollment as a tool this time. This is great... unless you are one of the open enrolled kids! Is it better or OK for that kid if they have to leave their school and friends? Some of the kids are Cedar Falls residents but are not in the CF district and we would like to be treated as such! Not like some second class citizen that is expendable!
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Post by cfschools on Feb 25, 2008 16:38:05 GMT -5
d1, let me first apologize. I did not mean to imply that open enrolled students are second class citizens or are expendable. I can see how it came across that way, and I apologize. I would rather no student be moved and if they had to move boundries that they would grandfather it in for entire families. But if they feel they have to move students, residents should have a priority. It is their hard earned tax money that goes into building those schools. They have made the decision to invest in cedar falls, buying homes, groceries, the local economy, etc. I don't know what your personal circumstanse is, I know there are situations where technically you're in cf but go to waterloo schools. That may be another battle worth fighting sometime. Unfortunately, that is not what this battle is about right now.
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d1
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Post by d1 on Feb 26, 2008 8:09:28 GMT -5
d1, let me first apologize. I did not mean to imply that open enrolled students are second class citizens or are expendable. I can see how it came across that way, and I apologize. I would rather no student be moved and if they had to move boundries that they would grandfather it in for entire families. But if they feel they have to move students, residents should have a priority. It is their hard earned tax money that goes into building those schools. They have made the decision to invest in cedar falls, buying homes, groceries, the local economy, etc. I don't know what your personal circumstanse is, I know there are situations where technically you're in cf but go to waterloo schools. That may be another battle worth fighting sometime. Unfortunately, that is not what this battle is about right now. Accepted... and I understand your concerns. We just need to remember that as parents, we all want what we feel is best for our kids. Unfortunately, it is not a win win situation for everyone.
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Post by forthekids on Feb 26, 2008 17:56:44 GMT -5
d1....if the district had taken action a couple of years ago when the crowding started to occur and just placed NEW open enrolled students in the least crowded school(s), we wouldn't be in such a mess. Ideally no one wants to move open enrolled students that have been in our schools for a long while.
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Post by open minded on Feb 26, 2008 18:36:11 GMT -5
There seems to be some information missing...you are correct that the buildings are not at capacity. However, this would max and cap class sizes, and specials (music, art, pe, library) would not be able to operate on the 6 day cycle the district is using. The specials teachers would be traveling from classroom to classroom on carts or other alternative spaces would need to be used as well as the common gym/lunch space. There is a lot more involved in the placement of students than simply following a "max-capacity" rule. In the best interest of all students in the district, it is important to remember class sizes do impact learning and quality of education. Both of these would be negatively impacted if you place nearly 600 students in a building with inadequate space to meet their needs. And yes...they have physical classroom space, but not enough space or staff to deliver a well rounded education.
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Post by cfschools on Feb 26, 2008 19:18:15 GMT -5
So, the question remains. Why did they build more classrooms at southdale if they were not going to be able to use them? I have yet to get an answer to this, and I am really curious? There has to be some reason that I'm missing and I would love to know.
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Post by open minded on Feb 26, 2008 20:07:22 GMT -5
When the final renovation is done, all classrooms will be used and some of the current rooms will be used differently, i.e. the media center will be made larger using existing classroom space. Even if you don't agree with the district's decision to build additional classrooms, that doesn't take away from large class sizes and even bigger specials classes if sections need to be combined, as they were last year, to fit the number of spots available in a schedule.
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Post by cfschools on Feb 26, 2008 20:47:19 GMT -5
Thank you for your answers. I'm sorry but I'm more confused now than before. I'm kinda new to all this so forgive me. But you seem familiar with what is going on and I'd like to pick your brain if you don't mind. Can you explain to me what exactly the problem is at southdale. I still don't quite understand. Is it a lack of space or would hiring additional staff be a potential fix? Or both? I guess what I'm asking is what would they need in terms of spaces (ie: lunchroom, gym, media room etc) and in terms of additional staff to be able to actually make use of the classrooms available to them?
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Post by kidscount on Feb 28, 2008 14:29:45 GMT -5
open minded,
so, going back to the above post, what will it take to make southdale whole?
when is all of this renovation that you talk about scheduled to be done?
when it is done, will all the students be moved back to their original schools?
or are we looking at a permanent solution to a temporary problem?
if you don't have these answers, whom might have them that we could contact?
again, as was posted before, we seem to get drips and drizzles of answers and information.
could someone please post all these plans that are somewhere in the future?
if all we are talking about it a multi-purpose room at southdale, that seems a relatively simple and inexpensive fix, compared to some of the alternatives.
thank you for any information you can give us.
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Post by dee on Feb 28, 2008 14:41:53 GMT -5
this is also to open minded:
you talk about using present classrooms to enlarge the media center? then down the road are we going through this all again when we need additional classrooms at southdale? if southdale is such a mess, too many classrooms and not enough "special" rooms, maybe we should just close the school altogether and shift the boundry lines further south and fill up north cedar? this just gets more and more ridiculous.
it is a wonder how our grandparents generation, known as the "greatest generation" ever managed, most of them being schooled in one room schools.
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Post by open minded on Mar 1, 2008 10:34:36 GMT -5
Dee what are you talking about, I just let people know what is going on at Southdale, now you are closing it
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Post by dee on Mar 5, 2008 21:24:52 GMT -5
open minded,
i am sorry if you did not catch the sarcasism in my post. of course closing southdale is not the answer.
btw, i would be interested in your answers to kidscount's questions.
just sign me,
still waiting
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angie
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Post by angie on Mar 10, 2008 16:58:31 GMT -5
This is in response to Ben's post - I've really been trying to understand where everyone is coming from throughout all of the discussions that have been held in regards to this boundary study, but I find myself left with the same question - Why does redrawing the boundaries seem like a short term "fix" to so many people? I agree that building a new elementary and shifting the majority of CF kids will be a long term solution, but I believe the boundary "shift" would be as well. Maybe someone could help me understand why it wouldn't be. It sounds like there's a great deal of negativity out there towards North Cedar and Orchard Hill. I'm sure that's now how people are intending to come across, but nevertheless, they are. I think something we all need to remember is the way our words and actions are being modeled for our children. I think it's great that people are standing up for what they believe in, but shouldn't we also be modeling how we handle things when they don't go the way we want them to?
So is a boundary change a short term, long term, or even a fix at all. I’ve been struggling with this question from the beginning. One of the proposals at the public forum would have moved El Dorado Heights from Southdale to Orchard Hill. The numbers shared in the public forum indicated that would move 52 kids. Let’s use that as an example to understand how much of a fix a boundary change is.
52 kids – distributed across seven grade levels, K-6. They will definitely not be evenly distributed but if they were it is 7.4 kids per grade level. Even if they are very unevenly distributed there is an almost zero chance there will be enough kids in any one grade level to reduce a section.
Southdale is a 3 section school. Although not every grade level has 3 sections most do, so let’s keep it simple. 7.4 kids per grade level divided by 3 sections = 2.5 kids per class.
Net results - no section reduction, so no substantial impact on the shared space constraints and we have relocated an entire neighborhood to reduce class sizes by 2.5 kids. In addition unlike open enrollment there is no way to “control” which grade levels these kids are removed from. It is equally reasonable to assume they are all in the grades that are less crowded as it is to assume they are in the grades that need some class size relief.
Is it really worth the hassle for that net result? Are we truly any better off when we are done? What is the price paid for the “reward” gained?
Worse yet the scenario isn’t finished. In order for Orchard Hill to absorb the 52 kids from Southdale it was proposed that married student housing and open enrollment students be moved from Orchard Hill. So assume we move 30-50 kids out of Orchard Hill. Now I have disrupted the lives of 80-100 kids in order to reduce class sizes on average by 2.5 kids at Southdale and with no section reduction to substantially improve the shared space constraint. The scenario isn’t done yet. The 30-50 kids would be moving to North Cedar. Since North Cedar is functioning as a 1 section school due to a declining enrollment it is now necessary to move additional kids to add a section to North Cedar. This chain reaction is likely to require an additional 50-70 kids be moved. Now we are up to 150 kids being moved to reduce class sizes at Southdale by 2.5 kids per class. Still the scenario isn’t finished. Who’s going to teach the new sections at North Cedar? It is unlikely that enough kids will be moved from any one grade level at any one school to free up a teacher. Now teachers must be added with an increased total cost to the district. Is this the “fix” we want?
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